Thursday, January 10, 2008

Replacing prophecies with bible stories

Mr. C said...

I just read this in the WELS Q&A. I remember my pastor mentioning something about this not too long ago also:

"A committee preparing Christian Worship Supplement (set for publication in July 2008) has revised the CW set of lessons somewhat. The same Gospel selections will be offered, but some of the Old Testament prophecies will be replaced by Old Testament "Bible stories" (narratives). This revised lectionary will also offer a set of Epistle readings that more closely match the Gospel theme and do not rely on lectio continua."

What do you all think about this? Replacing prophecies with bible stories? Similarly, do any of your churches use the one year lectionary cycle (I don't know if that is the right word/phrase)?


Mr. C -- January 10, 2008 4:06 PM
-----------------------------------------------
There is a paper about this here:

http://www.blc.edu/comm/gargy/gargy1/AlexRing.gpc.html



Pr. Ring

15 comments:

Anonymous said...

Well, unless you want to say that OT prophecy is somehow better than OT history, this is a moot point. Pitting one part of Scripture against another is never a good thing to do. But I'm sure that someone will find some way to criticize this decision, since it was made by the WELS.

Personally speaking, I love this decision. There are so many great accounts in the OT historical books--most of which the average church-goer has little to no knowledge of.

AGHEDASHJW

Mr. C said...

"Well, unless you want to say that OT prophecy is somehow better than OT history, this is a moot point."

AGHEDASHJW,

Brother, it was an honest question. Please don't be so dismissive by calling it a moot point. If others are curious about this, like I am, then it is not moot. I'm not trying to pit "one part of Scripture against another." I'm just curious why they are doing this and what other people think about it. Is there anything wrong with that?

"But I'm sure that someone will find some way to criticize this decision, since it was made by the WELS."

When you say things like that, you only invite it.

"There are so many great accounts in the OT historical books--most of which the average church-goer has little to no knowledge of."

If that is the case, do you think a bible study might be a better way to address this problem?

Thanks for the input. Any other takers--maybe someone without beaten-dog syndrome?

Mr. C

John said...

Mr. C.

Thanks for backing up your comment. It seems there are a few very defensive WELS posters.

I was intrigued by your comment. That's why I created a new thread. There was an earlier post on the new supplement.

Any other thoughts?

Anonymous said...

The three year lectionary was originally developed ecumenically by Roman Catholics and liberal Lutherans. There are some portions of Scripture that aren't covered at all in the ILCW series. Whether the OT lessons are from books of prophecy or from the historical books is a moot point. There are several other series out there that have been used well by Christians for centuries. Why not go back and use some of those?

Mr. C said...

"Whether the OT lessons are from books of prophecy or from the historical books is a moot point."

Are you the same person that said this earlier? Can someone explain why people keep saying this? I'm not saying it is good or bad either way, I'm just curious.

"There are several other series out there that have been used well by Christians for centuries."

Can you be more specific? Is there a different one that you or your church uses? Are there any strengths or weaknesses in using these different series?

Mr. C

Rev. Alexander Ring said...

There is a paper about this here:

http://www.blc.edu/comm/gargy/gargy1/AlexRing.gpc.html

Pr. Ring

Anonymous said...

This comment is not entirely germane, but I don't know where else to post it right now. My question is whether anyone thinks it would ever be defensible to leave a WELS church on grounds that the church is administratively inept.

Ours is seemingly doctrinal sound (unhappily, doctrine [which drew us to the church] is not really discussed), but the church council is badly run, e.g., no meeting agendas published, no minutes of meetings kept, ignorance of the law regarding annual statements of contributions, deficient annual budgets published due to outdated bookkeeping practices, etc.

I realize this all may sound like small potatoes, but, boy, does it get irritating when you're trying to learn whether the church's stewards are using our resources wisely.

I am new to the WELS and have been told ad nauseaum (by council members) that "Lutherans don't change!" Our pastor sympathizes with me, but he thinks it's not his place to interfere in administrative matters.

Compounding the problem is the council's attitude toward women. Our church has a talented former business and political leader (female), who has made any number of good administrative recommendations to the council. Though the pastor says privately he sees wisdom in these suggestions, the council doesn't want to hear from a woman! But one wily councilman has begun to present a few of the woman's suggestions to the council as his own, in order to get them a hearing. Isn't this incredible? When the woman heard this, however, she burst into tears and said she felt terribly insulted. This is the first church I've belonged to in which women don't vote. Does a lack of a vote mean a lack of a voice?

Many of us expect the church to simply run out of money soon. While some budget changes now might forestall what appears be our inevitable demise, it looks like nothing will happen.

Again, I'm new to the WELS. Is this kind of council mentality common in the synod?

wels-bot said...

just leave, if you are gonna take adveice from a stupid blog you dont care anyway

WELSBOT said...

wels-bot:

"just leave, if you are gonna take adveice (sic) from a stupid blog you dont care anyway"

That's not a very WELS thing to say. Now come up with your own name.

WB

Anonymous said...

Ha, i saw a post of yours after i posted and relized my mistake sorry. but this blog is not very WELS like thing either. just a place for the bored wels haters to gossip and talk trash about our synod. Oh wait now i will be called a welsbot for saying that, oh well your blog is stupid anyway youtr just a bunch if blogsbots

not punctuated or grammaticaly corect due to the fact that its a blog and i dont care

Anonymous said...

"oh well your blog is stupid anyway youtr just a bunch if blogsbots"

Your not doing your cult any favors by spouting off like a child.

RandomDan said...

I appreciate Pr. Ring's paper on the lectionaries. It included a lot of information that I did not know.

The changes are definitely positive overall. Matching the epistle to the Gospel is a positive development. I just hope the people in charge kept the prophesy passages where they are fitting.

Anonymous said...

my cult? please explain, are you calling this blog a cult or the WELS?

Anonymous said...

To complete the story: I'm "Anonymous" above who asked about leaving a WELS church on grounds of a terrible church council. We've decided to go; it's clear that every Christian (or every Lutheran, for that matter) is not WELS material. I conclude that if you weren't raised in this synod, you are at a considerable disadvantage in surviving in it. Good bye.

/s/ Anonymous

John said...

anonymous above...

Have you found a confessional Lutheran church?