tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8818242304034182219.post336223746022670410..comments2023-04-26T04:36:47.052-05:00Comments on Bailing Water: The Office of the Holy Ministry (sic) in WisconsinUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8818242304034182219.post-25099939049355909922010-04-07T11:06:39.460-05:002010-04-07T11:06:39.460-05:00This article is typical of so many articles on the...This article is typical of so many articles on the doctrine of the ministry. It pits human writers against human writers without even one (that's right, not even one) clearly expounded scripture, leave alone a majority of scriptures which speak to the doctrine. I have struggled to fully grasp both sides of the old Synodical Conference's doctrine of the ministry for years and find flaws in both when they are carried to their logical extremes in practice (which both have been in the history of the WELS and LC-MS).<br />This lack of biblical evidence warps this article as it does so many others. It seems to come across that we understand the Bible in light of the confessions instead of saying we understand the confessions in light of the Bible. Which is the ultimate authority and sheds light on the other? <br />There is a reason why the doctrine of the ministy was not devisive in the Synodical Conference. With the wholesome tension, neither WELS nor LC-MS could carry its doctrine to its logical extreme. Now, almost fifty years after the break in fellowship, both WELS and LC-MS have factions which are taking their doctrine of the ministry to its logical extreme and the weaknesses in the logical extremes of both are showing.<br /><br />At the Diet of Worms Luther asked to be shown from scripture or sound reason what was not true about his teachings. In this current case of the doctrine of the ministry, sound reason has not prevailed because there has been mostly an unending pitting of the church fathers against each other to no avail. What we need is clear and determinative exegesis of the sedes passages on the ministry, followed by clear and determinative exegesis of non-sedes doctrines on the ministry. Even there one problem will be to find unbiased exegetes on either side. It iseems we are more interested in doing exegesis of Walther, Pieper, Schaller, and Meyer, rather than the scriptures. That has led to confusion and to the weakness of our arguments. If we can only "prove" a position by quoting the church fathers, but cannot "prove" the same position by quoting sola scriptura, we have gone the way of Rome.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8818242304034182219.post-68945391867772610962010-03-02T08:05:16.659-06:002010-03-02T08:05:16.659-06:00Oustanding essay. I can imagine it makes some in ...Oustanding essay. I can imagine it makes some in the (W)ELS uncomfortable if they are yet in any way concerned with the pure teaching of God's Word. <br /><br />This was the specific issue over which my family left the WELS. I'll post the final statement from Holy Trinity Lutheran Church, Des Moines Wa. following a month long discussion concerning women reading the liturgy during the divine service.<br /><br />August 18, 2006<br />From: HTLC Board of Elders<br /><br />Stan Bauer<br />Tad Doviak<br />Monte Ewald<br />Dave Fulton<br />Kevin Nack<br />Dan Smith<br />Mark Tacke<br /><br />To: Brett Meyer<br /><br />Dear Brett,<br />You originally e-mailed the Board of Elders regarding the question of antiphonal worship at Holy Trinity. After prayerful consideration and study of the Word in this matter we believe that antiphonal worship <b>is a proclamation or reading of God's inspired word and is not considered to be 'teaching' the congregation</b>. Reading of scripture as a congregation is an activity to be encouraged in worship. Teaching of scripture is an activity that the Lord in His Word has clearly reserved for the Pastor or other duly appointed official man of the congregation. Furthermore, the Board of Elders considers you to be in fellowship with Holy Trinity and the WELS. Thank you for bringing this important issue to the Board.<br /><br />Note that all is well at HTLC because reading God's Word is no longer concidered teaching when read by a woman. They've adopted the RCC view that it only teaches when read by someone who's been "duly appointed".<br /><br />Repeat after me, "10 Hail Mary's and 15 Our Fathers..." Scoot over Benke someone else wants to kiss the Papal ring.<br /><br />Brett MeyerBrett Meyerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15916121605136512091noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8818242304034182219.post-27878330089342522042010-02-19T10:30:44.346-06:002010-02-19T10:30:44.346-06:00This comment has been removed by the author.Joe Krohnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08675123326627773329noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8818242304034182219.post-2358194572141181922010-02-17T22:40:00.026-06:002010-02-17T22:40:00.026-06:00This comment has been removed by the author.Ichabod the Glory Has Departedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03119183283328283096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8818242304034182219.post-51746030809420574812010-02-17T12:15:13.159-06:002010-02-17T12:15:13.159-06:00Boys, boys. Go sit in the corner until you can pla...Boys, boys. Go sit in the corner until you can play nicely.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8818242304034182219.post-21806584924582424472010-02-17T09:36:17.516-06:002010-02-17T09:36:17.516-06:00This comment has been removed by the author.Joe Krohnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08675123326627773329noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8818242304034182219.post-53843214791714809142010-02-16T10:08:55.667-06:002010-02-16T10:08:55.667-06:00This comment has been removed by the author.Ichabod the Glory Has Departedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03119183283328283096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8818242304034182219.post-7550699690686873832010-02-15T09:55:24.335-06:002010-02-15T09:55:24.335-06:00This comment has been removed by the author.Joe Krohnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08675123326627773329noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8818242304034182219.post-83595002833984453142010-02-14T18:07:00.220-06:002010-02-14T18:07:00.220-06:00This comment has been removed by the author.Ichabod the Glory Has Departedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03119183283328283096noreply@blogger.com